Well, one reply did come in from Uncle June (look down below to the longer of the previous postings.) I started a follow up comment to him, but then recognized that some of these additional thoughts were at least curious (to me) and worth sharing, and doubtful that any of you might actually wade through all of the comments out here. So, here's what I ended up saying in response to his comment:
No, I didn't feel that I was beat at that moment. (It became abundantly clear when he rolled over his pocket 6's though, for a flopped set.) I'm just trying to decide if this was my rookie mistake or if it was just one of those situations where I was destined to lose a lot of chips (which I did.) BUT, if I'm suggesting that when you bet out TPTK after the flop (with a hand you raised with preflop too) and get raised post flop, that you should be folding... I'm afraid that sounds as if I'm playing like too much of a NIT! Or should I always assume that to be at that point a weak holding when raised?
I don't want to rationalize this away if I screwed up, I'm really trying to heed the lessons of Alan Schoonmaker's book, Your Worst Poker Enemy. Losers will continue to blame bad luck and rationalize away their own poor plays. Those trying to become winners, will analyze and reflect and learn from mistakes. Here, though I want to make sure I'm learning the correct lesson.
I don't want this "story" to come across as a bad beat story (it wasn't,) or that I always lose with a particular hand or good cards, because frankly of course I always lose with good cards, as I try not to play trash hands in the first place. I also win with good cards.
BWoP, if you stumble across this mess of postings, I'm particularly interested in your thoughts on this, if you're willing to share. My reason... I think you have more cash game experience than a lot of folks. You're not the type to offer up cure-all poker advice which we all know doesn't exist in the first place, as the answer to most questions continues to be "it depends..."
Also, in other unrelated upcoming events:
Don't forget tomorrow night, November 13th (yes, Friday the 13th) its yet another installment of the Eagles' Poker Tournament. Registration begins at 6:00pm, game at 7:00pm. $25 gets you in it, to win it! Also JINX'D is playing starting at 9:00pm, so those who bust out early will have some great music to listen to while they console their egos with copious amounts of adult beverage. Hope to see you all there! Be warned cheer_dad's looking to replenish the bankroll. Only with your help can I make that a reality! : P
Regards,
cheer_dad
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2 comments:
Ok...apologies if you have already covered this:
How much was in the pot after your bet on the flop?
How much more was it for you to be all in?
How much would you have left had you not called?
If I'm reading your post correctly, you had about $170 before the hand started. Villain had a ton more chips than that (let's just say villain had $400).
Action limps around to you in the SB and you raise to $15, getting 3 other callers. (Pot is now approx. $65. I know, it would be an even number b/c of the limps, but I want to do easy math.)
You bet $60 into a $65 pot on the flop, leaving you about $95 behind. Villain puts you all-in. Villain would not lose more than 1/2 of his stack if he loses the hand. However, you have invested 45% of your stack to this point and are getting about 3-1 on a call.
I'm not sure how you would classify villain as a player, but if I were villain, I would guess that it is more likely than not that you will make the call, thus negating any fold equity. Therefore, I'd have to be pretty confident in my hand to shove there.
However, if I were you, I think it would be a tough fold. Limp-calling range probably puts him on hands that contain a Q with a weaker kicker, connectors and small pocket pairs. Therefore, the only *reasonable* hands that you could put him on that are ahead of you are 6-6 or 4-4 or possibly 6-4. A-A or K-K or Q-Q would have probably raised pre-flop given the limpiness of the table.
Given your stack size and ranges, I'd probably make the call.
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